I want to talk about atheists and anger. This has been a hard piece to write and it may be a hard one to read. I'm not going to be as polite and good-tempered as I usually am in this blog; this piece is about anger and for once I'm going to fucking well let myself be angry. But I think it's important. One of the most common criticisms lobbed at the newly-vocal atheist community is. "Why do you have to be so angry?" So I want to talk about:1. Why atheists are angry;2. Why our anger is valid valuable and necessary;And 3. Why it's completely fucked-up to try to take our anger away from us. So let's start with why we're angry. Or rather -- because this is my blog and I don't presume to speak for all atheists -- why I'm angry.*****I'm angry that according to a recent Gallup poll only 45 percent of Americans would vote for an atheist for President. I'm angry that atheist conventions have to have extra security including hand-held metal detectors and bag searches because of fatwas and death threats. I'm angry that atheist soldiers -- in the U. S armed forces -- have had prayer ceremonies pressured on them and atheist meetings broken up by Christian superior officers in direct violation of the First Amendment. I'm angry that evangelical Christian groups are being given exclusive access to proselytize on military bases -- again in the U. S armed forces again in direct violation of the First Amendment. I'm angry that atheist soldiers who are complaining about this are being harassed and are even getting death threats from Christian soldiers and superior officers -- yet again in the U. S armed forces. And I'm angry that Christians still say smug sanctimonious things like. "there are no atheists in foxholes." You know why you're not seeing atheists in foxholes? Because believers are threatening to shoot them if they come out. I'm angry that the 41st President of the United States. George Herbert Walker Bush said of atheists in my lifetime. "No. I don't know that atheists should be regarded as citizens nor should they be regarded as patriotic. This is one nation under God." My President. No. I didn't vote for him but he was still my President and he still said that my lack of religious belief meant that I shouldn't be regarded as a citizen. I'm angry that it took until 1961 for atheists to be guaranteed the right to serve on juries testify in court or hold public office in every state in the country. I'm angry that almost half of Americans believe in creationism. And not a broad. "God had a hand in evolution" creationism but a strict young-earth. "God created man pretty much in his present form at one time within the last 10,000 years" creationism. And on that topic: I'm angry that school boards all across this country are still -- 82 years after the Scopes trial -- having to spend time and money and resources on the fight to have evolution taught in the schools. School boards are not exactly loaded with time and money and resources and any of the time/ money/ resources that they're spending fighting this stupid fight is time/ money/ resources that they're not spending you know teaching. I'm angry that women are dying of AIDS in Africa and South America because the Catholic Church has convinced them that using condoms makes baby Jesus cry. I'm angry that women are having septic abortions -- or are being forced to have unwanted children who they resent and mistreat -- because religious organizations have gotten laws passed making abortion illegal or inaccessible. I'm angry about what happened to Galileo. Still. And I'm angry that it took the Catholic Church until 1992 to apologize for it. I get angry when advice columnists tell their troubled letter-writers to talk to their priest or minister or rabbi.. when there is absolutely no legal requirement that a religious leader have any sort of training in counseling or therapy. And I get angry when religious leaders offer counseling and advice to troubled people -- sex advice relationship advice advice on depression and stress etc. -- not based on any evidence about what actually does and does not work in people's brains and lives but on the basis of what their religious doctrine tells them God wants for us. I'm angry at preachers who tell women in their flock to submit to their husbands because it's the will of God even when their husbands are beating them within an inch of their lives. I'm angry that so many believers treat prayer as a sort of cosmic shopping list for God. I'm angry that believers pray to win sporting events poker hands beauty pageants and more. As if they were the center of the universe as if God gives a shit about who wins the NCAA Final Four -- and as if the other teams/ players/ contestants weren't praying just as hard. I'm especially angry that so many believers treat prayer as a cosmic shopping list when it comes to health and illness. I'm angry that this belief leads to the revolting conclusion that God deliberately makes people sick so they’ll pray to him to get better. And I'm angry that they foist this belief on sick and dying children -- in essence teaching them that if they don't get better it's their fault. That they didn't pray hard enough or they didn't pray right or God just doesn't love them enough. And I get angry when other believers insist that the cosmic shopping list isn't what religion and prayer are really about; that their own sophisticated theology is the true understanding of God. I get angry when believers insist that the shopping list is a straw man an outmoded form of religion and prayer that nobody takes seriously and it's absurd for atheists to criticize it. I get angry when believers use terrible grief-soaked tragedies as either opportunities to toot their own horns and talk about how wonderful their God and their religion are.. or as opportunities to attack and demonize atheists and secularism. I'm angry at the Sunday school teacher who told comic artist Craig Thompson that he couldn't draw in heaven. And I'm angry that she said it with the complete conviction of authority.. when in fact she had no basis whatsoever for that assertion. How the hell did she know what Heaven was like? How could she possibly know that you could sing in heaven but not draw? And why the hell would you say something that squelching and dismissive to a talented child?I'm angry that Mother Teresa took her personal suffering and despair at her lost faith in God and turned it into an obsession that led her to treat suffering as a beautiful gift from Christ to humanity a beautiful offering from humanity to God and a necessary part of spiritual salvation. And I'm angry that this obsession apparently led her to offer grotesquely inadequate medical care and pain relief at her hospitals and hospices in essence taking her personal crisis of faith out on millions of desperately poor and helpless people. I'm angry at the trustee of the local Presbyterian church who told his teenage daughter that he didn't actually believe in God or religion but that it was important to keep up his work because without religion there would be no morality in the world. I'm angry that so many parents and religious leaders terrorize children -- who (a) have brains that are hard-wired to trust adults and believe what they're told and (b) are very literal-minded -- with vivid traumatizing stories of eternal burning and torture to ensure that they'll be too frightened to even question religion. I'm angrier when religious leaders explicitly tell children – and adults for that matter -- that the very questioning of religion and the existence of hell is a dreadful sin one that will guarantee them that hell is where they'll end up. I'm angry that children get taught by religion to hate and fear their bodies and their sexuality. And I'm especially angry that female children get taught by religion to hate and fear their femaleness and that queer children get taught by religion to hate and fear their queerness. I'm angry about the Muslim girl in the public school who was told -- by her public-school taxpayer-paid teacher -- that the red stripes on Christmas candy canes represented Christ's blood that she had to believe in and be saved by Jesus Christ or she'd be condemned to hell and that if she didn't there was no place for her in his classroom. And I'm angry that he told her not to come back to his class when she didn't convert. I'm angry -- enraged -- at the priests who molest children and tell them it's God's will. I'm enraged at the Catholic Church that consciously deliberately repeatedly for years acted to protect priests who molested children and consciously and deliberately acted to keep it a secret placing the Church's reputation as a higher priority than for fuck's sake children not being molested. And I'm enraged that the Church is now trying to argue in court that protecting child-molesting priests from prosecution and shuffling those priests from diocese to diocese so they can molest kids in a whole new community that doesn't yet suspect them is a Constitutionally protected form of free religious expression. I'm angry about 9/11. And I'm angry that Jerry Falwell blamed 9/11 on pagans abortionists feminists gays and lesbians the ACLU and the People For the American Way. I'm angry that the theology of a wrathful God exacting revenge against pagans and abortionists by sending radical Muslims to blow up a building full of secretaries and investment bankers.. this was a theology held by a powerful widely-respected religious leader with millions of followers. I'm angry that when my dad had a stroke and went into a nursing home the staff asked my brother. "Is he a Baptist or a Catholic?" And I'm not just angry on behalf of my atheist dad. I'm angry on behalf of all the Jews all the Buddhists all the Muslims all the neo-Pagans whose families almost certainly got asked that same question. That question is enormously disrespectful not just of my dad's atheism but of everyone at that nursing home who wasn't a Baptist or a Catholic. I'm angry about Ingrid's grandparents. I'm angry that their fundamentalism was such a huge source of strife and unhappiness in her family that it alienated them so drastically from their children and grandchildren. I'm angry that they tried to cram it down Ingrid's throat to the point that she's still traumatized by it. And I'm angry that their religion which if nothing else should have been a comfort to them in their old age was instead a source of anguish and despair -- because they knew their children and grandchildren were all going to be burned and tortured forever in Hell and how could Heaven be Heaven if their children and grandchildren were being eternally burned and tortured in Hell?I'm angry that Ingrid and I can't get legally married in this country -- or get legally married in another country and have it recognized by this one -- largely because religious leaders oppose it. And I'm angry that both religious and political leaders have discovered that they can score big points exploiting people's fears about sexuality in a changing world fanning the flames of those fears.. and giving people a religious excuse for why their fears are justified. I'm angry that huge swaths of public policy in this country -- not just on same-sex marriage but on abortion and stem-cell research and sex education in schools -- are being based not on evidence of which policies do and don't work and what is and isn't true about the world but on religious texts written hundreds or thousands of years ago and on their own personal feelings about how those texts should be interpreted with no supporting evidence whatsoever -- and no apparent concept of why any evidence should be needed. I get angry when believers trumpet every good thing that's ever been done in the name of religion as a reason why religion is a force for good.. and then when confronted with the horrible evils done in religion's name say that those evils weren't done because of religion were done because of politics of greed or fear or whatever would have been done anyway even without religion and shouldn't be counted as religion's fault. (Of course to be fair. I also get angry when atheists do the opposite: chalk up every evil thing done in the name of religion as a black mark on religion's record but then insist that the good things were done for other reasons and would have been done anyway etc. Neither side gets to have it both ways.)I'm angry at the believers who put decals on their cars with a Faith fish eating a Darwin fish.. and who think that's clever who think that religious faith really should triumph over science and evidence. I'm angry at believers who have so little respect for the physical world their God supposedly created that they feel perfectly content to ignore the mountains of physical evidence piling up around them about that real world; perfectly content to see that world as somehow less real and true than their personal opinions about God.(Note: The litany of specific grievances is now more than halfway over. Analysis of why anger is necessary and valuable is coming up soon. Promise.)I get angry when religious leaders opportunistically use religion and people's trust and faith in religion to steal cheat lie manipulate the political process take sexual advantage of their followers and generally behave like the scum of the earth. I get angry when it happens over and over and over again. And I get angry when people see this happening and still say that atheism is bad because without religion people would have no basis for morality or ethics and no reason not to just do whatever they wanted. I get angry when religious believers make arguments against atheism -- and make accusations against atheists -- without having bothered to talk to any atheists or read any atheist writing. I get angry when they trot out the same old "Atheism is a nihilistic philosophy with no joy or meaning to life and no basis for morality or ethics".. when if they spent ten minutes in the atheist blogosphere they would discover countless atheists who experience great joy and meaning in their lives and are intensely concerned about right and wrong. I get angry when believers use the phrase "atheist fundamentalist" without apparently knowing what the word "fundamentalist" means. Call people pig-headed call them stubborn call them snarky call them intolerant even. But unless you can point to the text to which these "fundamentalist" atheists literally and strictly adhere without question then please shut the hell up about us being fundamentalist. I get angry when religious believers base their entire philosophy of life on what is at best a hunch; when they ignore or reject or rationalize any evidence that contradicts that hunch or calls it into question.. and then accuse atheists of being close-minded and ignoring the obvious truth. And I get angry when believers glorify religious faith without evidence as a positive virtue a character trait that makes people good and noble.. and then continue to accuse atheists of being close-minded and ignoring the obvious truth. I get angry when believers say that they can know the truth -- the greatest truth of all about the nature of the universe namely the source of all existence -- simply by sitting quietly and listening to their heart.. and then accuse atheists of being arrogant. (This isn't just arrogant towards atheists and naturalists either. It's arrogant towards people of other religions who have sat just as quietly listened to their hearts with just as much sincerity and come to completely opposite conclusions about God and the soul and the universe.)And I get angry when believers say that the entire unimaginable enormity of the universe was made solely and specifically for the human race -- when atheists by contrast say that humanity is a microscopic dot on a microscopic dot an infinitesimal eyeblink in the vastness of time and space -- and yet again believers accuse atheists of being arrogant. I get angry when believers say things like. "Yes of course the human mind isn't perfect we see what we expect to see we see faces and patterns and intention when they aren't necessarily there.. but that couldn't be happening with me. The patterns I see in my life.. they couldn't possibly be coincidence or confirmation bias. I'm definitely seeing the hand of God." (And then once again those same believers accuse atheists of being close-minded and only seeing what we want to see.)I get angry when believers treat the gaps in science and scientific knowledge as somehow proof of the existence of God. I get angry when despite a thousands-of-years-old pattern of supernatural explanations being consistently and repeatedly replaced with natural ones they still think every single unexplained phenomenon can be best explained by God. And I'm angry that whenever a gap in our knowledge does get filled in believers either try to suppress it (see above re: evolution in the schools) or else say. "Okay that part of the world isn't supernatural.. but what about this gap over here? Can you explain that. Mr. Smarty-Pants Scientist? You can't! It must be God!"I get angry when believers say at the beginning of an argument that their belief is based on reason and evidence and at the end of the argument say things like. "It just seems that way to me," or. "I feel it in my heart".. as if that were a clincher. I mean couldn't they have said that at the beginning of the argument and not wasted my fucking time? My time is valuable and increasingly limited and I have better things to do with it than debating with people who pretend to care about evidence and reason but ultimately don't. I'm angry that I have to know more about their fucking religion than the believers do. I get angry when believers say things about the tenets and texts of their religion that are flatly untrue and I have to correct them on it. I get angry when believers treat any criticism of their religion -- i e. pointing out that their religion is a hypothesis about the world and a philosophy of it and asking it to stand up on its own in the marketplace of ideas -- as insulting and intolerant. I get angry when believers accuse atheists of being intolerant for saying things like. "I don't agree with you," "I think you're mistaken about that," "That doesn't make any sense," "I think that position is morally indefensible," and "What evidence do you have to support that?"And on that point: I get angry when Christians in the United States -- members of the single most powerful and influential religious group in the country in the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world -- act like beleaguered victims martyrs being thrown to the lions all over again whenever anyone criticizes them or they don't get their way. I get angry when believers respond to some or all of these offenses by saying. "Well that's not the true faith. Hating queers/ rejecting science/ stifling questions and dissent.. that's not the true faith. People who do that aren't real (Christians/ Jews/ Muslims/ Hindus/ etc.)." As if they had a fucking pipeline to God. As if they had any reason at all to think that they know for sure what God wants and that the billions of others who disagree with them just obviously have it wrong. (Besides -- I'm an atheist. The "They just aren't doing religion right" argument is not going to cut it with me. I don't think any of you have it right. To me it all looks like something that people just made up.)On that topic: I get angry when religious believers insist that their interpretation of their religion and religious text is the right one and that fellow believers with an opposite interpretation clearly have it wrong. I get angry when believers insist that the parts about Jesus's prompt return and all prayers being answered are obviously not meant literally.. but the parts about hell and damnation and gay sex being an abomination that's real. And I get angry when believers insist that the parts about hell and damnation and gay sex being an abomination aren't meant literally but the parts about caring for the poor are really what God meant. How the hell do they know which parts of the Bible/ Torah/ Koran/ Bhagavad-Gita/ whatever God really meant and which parts he didn't? And if they don't know if they're just basing it on their own moral instincts and their own perceptions of the world then on what basis are they thinking that God and their sacred texts have anything to do with it at all? What right do they have to act as if their opinion is the same as God's and he's totally backing them up on it?And I get angry when believers act as if these offenses aren't important because "Not all believers act like that. I don't act like that." As if that fucking matters. This stuff is a major way that religion plays out in our world and it makes me furious to hear religious believers try to minimize it because it's not how it happens to play out for them. It's like a white person responding to an African-American describing their experience of racism by saying. "But I'm not a racist." If you're not a racist then can you shut the hell up for ten seconds and listen to the black people talk? And if you’re not bigoted against atheists and are sympathetic to us then can you shut the hell up for ten seconds and let us tell you about what the world is like for us without getting all defensive about how it's not your fault? When did this international conversation about atheism and religious oppression become all about you and your hurt feelings?But perhaps most of all. I get angry -- sputteringly inarticulately pulse-racingly angry -- when believers chide atheists for being so angry. "Why do you have to be so angry all the time?" "All that anger is so off-putting." "If atheism is so great then why are so many of you so angry?"Which brings me to the other part of this little rant: Why atheist anger is not only valid but valuable and necessary.*****There's actually a simple straightforward answer to this question:Because anger is always necessary. Because anger has driven every major movement for social change in this country and probably in the world. The labor movement the civil rights movement the women's suffrage movement the modern feminist movement the gay rights movement the anti-war movement in the Sixties the anti-war movement today you name it.. all of them have had as a major driving force a tremendous amount of anger. Anger over injustice anger over mistreatment and brutality anger over helplessness. I mean why the hell else would people bother to mobilize social movements? Social movements are hard. They take time they take energy they sometimes take serious risk of life and limb community and career. Nobody would fucking bother if they weren't furious about something. So when you tell an atheist (or for that matter a woman or a queer or a person of color or whatever) not to be so angry you are in essence telling us to disempower ourselves. You're telling us to lay down one of the single most powerful tools we have at our disposal. You're telling us to lay down a tool that no social change movement has ever been able to do without. You're telling us to be polite and diplomatic when history shows that polite diplomacy in a social change movement works far far better when it's coupled with passionate anger. In a battle between David and Goliath you're telling David to put down his slingshot and just... I don't know. Gnaw Goliath on the ankles or something. I'll acknowledge that anger is a difficult tool in a social movement. A dangerous one even. It can make people act rashly; it can make it harder to think clearly; it can make people treat potential allies as enemies. In the worst-case scenario it can even lead to violence. Anger is valid it's valuable it's necessary.. but it can also misfire and badly. But unless we're actually endangering or harming somebody it is not up to believers to tell atheists when we should and should not use this tool. It is not up to believers to tell atheists that we're going too far with the anger and need to calm down. Any more than it's up to white people to say it to black people or men to say it to women or straights to say it to queers. When it comes from believers it's not helpful. It's patronizing. It comes across as another attempt to defang us and shut us up. And it's just going to make us angrier. And when believers tell passionate angry atheists that extremism is never right and the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle they're making a big big mistake. Not just because they're making us want to spit in their eye. They're making a mistake because they're simply mistaken. Read this piece from Daylight Atheism on The Golden Mean. Read the quotes from the abolitionist movement the civil rights movement the anti-war movement the American Revolution. And then come tell me that the moderate position is usually the right one. And you know what else? I think we need to have some goddamn perspective about this anger business. I mean. I look at organized Christianity in this country -- not just the religious right but some more "moderate" churches as well -- interfering with AIDS prevention efforts trying to get their theology into the public schools actively trying to prevent me and Ingrid from getting legally married and pulling all the other shit I talk about in this piece. And I look at atheists sometimes being mean-spirited and snarky in blogs and books and magazines. And I think. Can we please have some goddamn perspective? Because the other thing I'm angry about is the fact that in this piece. I've touched on -- maybe -- a hundredth of everything that angers me about religion. This piece barely scratches the surface. I know almost without a doubt that within five minutes of hitting "Post" and putting this piece on my blog. I'll think of six different things that I'd wished I'd put in. I could write an entire book about everything that angers me about religion -- other people certainly have -- and still not be finished. Are you really looking at all of this shit I'm talking about a millennia-old history of abuse and injustice deceit and willful ignorance -- and then on the other hand looking at a couple of years of atheists being snarky on the Internet -- and seeing the two as somehow equivalent? Or worse seeing the snarky atheists as the greater problem?If you're doing that then with all due respect you can blow me. We now return you to your regularly scheduled attempts at civility. Addendum: If you're having trouble commenting seeing your comment or reading the other comments on this post please read this. Thanks. October 15. 2007 in Atheism. Politics | Permalink CommentsI used to answer medical questions on a couple of online fora and would occasionally wander into their religion areas. I'd point to the huge inconsistencies in the arguments that god is omniscient and omni-powerful.. and that most christians argue that the reason to do good is to reap eternal reward or avoid eternal punishment -- a damn selfish reason. I'd point out that a god that would create humans imperfect -- as christians say -- means that he deliberately did so knowing most couldn't follow his rules and would therefore boil in oil for eternity. Give them life for the blink of an eye set up some rules that billions can't follow burn them for a trillion years times a trillion. Sort of a pervert seems to me. And that if you believe in the power of prayer you must also believe that god is fallable or capricious or both. Anyhow one person with whom I was making these arguments said I'd caused him to question his faith. So I stopped posting there. Made me feel bad. Now if people truly keep their religion to themselves it's ok by me. But as it's becoming more and more public and the effect is to dumn down our entire country and to poison our politics to the point of hopelessness as the effect of "religion" is to perpetuate hate for entire classes of people it's time to start talking again. You give it a heck of a start. Posted by: Sid Schwab | October 15. 2007 at 08:49 AM All this anger is well-directed as far as I'm concerned. I think emotions are the body's way of telling us that something is not right and needs to be corrected. You're right if there was no anger nothing would change. Anger is a very useful force but gets a bad name from people who can't be angry without being blatantly aggressive and destructive. As for the previous comment congratulations to the author for getting someone to question their faith. I have spiritual beliefs but they are completely different from what they were twenty years ago and will probably be different twenty years from now. It seems to me that having one concrete set of beliefs and attitudes for a lifetime would feel very confining and boring whether those beliefs included spiritual aspects or not. (This is not a dig at athiesm. The happy atheists that I know have evolved their beliefs over the course of a lifetime and their ethics and philosophies continue to evolve.) I just wonder as a person who welcomes new information and perspectives what it must be like to be so insecure in one's beliefs that questioning them brings about a crisis. Posted by: Shannon Brown | October 15. 2007 at 10:15 AM This is a fantastic and honestly sometimes emotionally difficult piece to read. As an agnostic spiritual humanist as someone who feels spirituality but doesn't buy into religion. I'm also angry about a ton of these things. But some of them. I think I understand why theists fear your anger. (Specifically: "I get angry when believers treat any criticism of their religion -- i e. pointing out that their religion is a hypothesis about the world and a philosophy of it and asking it to stand up on its own in the marketplace of ideas -- as insulting and intolerant.")It's because they're afraid that atheists are going to take away their faith from them. Not change their minds so much but rather not allow them to have the faith the spirituality that gives so much to their lives. I'm all about people believing or not believing what they want as long as they don't force it on other people and as long as it harms noone. I understand how important it is to point out the flaws and fallacies in religion for people who accept their religion as right not just for themselves but for everyone. But when you try to point out these things to someone who wants to mind their own business with their religion it feels like you're out to take their religion away from them by proving them wrong. It feels like you want to dissolve that which gives them joy and hope by proving it illogical and irrelevant. As someone who recognizes the fallacies of religion but still has extremely powerful emotional response via spirituality which can be triggered by the trappings of religion it feels like when people argue with what works for us you're out to take that away from people who feel it. I believe some people are wired to want religion to need it to crave it and others aren't. Of course. I have no formal data to back this up but I'd love to see a study done on it. As long as those people don't force their views on other people what's wrong with having religion or faith? (Now agreed quite a few people of faith DO try to force it on other people and I'm right up there with you fighting back.)And I think the outside world needs to ask: what is it that you the atheists want? We (at least now) know WHY you're angry.. but in the words of social movements what are your demands? What is it that you'd like to see changed? Is it a world without belief without religion? (I doubt it.. few atheists that at least I know are that militant or "hardcore".) Is it mere acknowledgment of your existence? Is it a greater sensitivity and awareness in our relations and laws? What is it that atheists want?For surely you don't WANT to be angry. (Well maybe some do. Anger can be quite intoxicating.) You've been forced into anger at the breaking point so that you can get your needs met. What is it that atheists really want?Posted by: c4bl3fl4m3 | October 15. 2007 at 12:15 PM You're beautiful when you're angry! I kid. I kid. But you make an incredible point: we aren't going to convince the godheads that they're wrong - about the things that you've noted and more - by as you say gnawing on their ankles. Awesome post!Posted by: Pi Guy | October 15. 2007 at 06:28 PM "Are you really looking at all of this shit I'm talking about a millennia-old history of abuse and injustice deceit and willful ignorance -- and then on the other hand looking at a couple of years of atheists being snarky on the Internet -- and seeing the two as somehow equivalent?"No. Repeating pseudohistory about beliefs in Mithras or Osiris isn't nearly as dangerous or far-reaching as the pseudohistory of creationism. Quote-mining John Adams to make him look like an atheist isn't quite as pernicious as quote-mining him to making him look like an orthodox Christian. An implausible slandering of a majority as cretins or nuts is far less of a hazard as an slander of a minority like atheists that is treated as fact. But it is still pseudohistory. It is still quote-mining. It is still slander. And two wrongs do not make a right. Posted by: J. J. Ramsey | October 15. 2007 at 07:24 PM Me too. Posted by: miz_geek | October 15. 2007 at 07:30 PM Er.. Galileo was treated with kid gloves. His long-standing friendship with then-pope Urban VIII certainly helped although calling him a simpleton in print didn't. But he had very good reason to fear because Giordano Bruno had been burned at the stake for heresy a few years earlier. I really wish people would remember remember Bruno a little more. Posted by: Eclectic | October 15. 2007 at 07:31 PM Me too. Posted by: miz_geek | October 15. 2007 at 07:31 PM c4bl3fl4m3: "What is it that atheists really want?"Depends. For some atheists the agenda is to be treated like human beings and accepted as first-class citizens. For others it is to knock back the influence of religion or get rid of it altogether. For yet others it is the promotion of evidence-based thinking over trust in handed-down traditions that are less than trustworthy. Posted by: J. J. Ramsey | October 15. 2007 at 07:42 PM And good point about dogma. I've never read more than snippets the damned thing but even I know that the catholic bible and the protestant bible are different and the Lutheran and Calvinist branches of protestantism disagree on what the sixth commandment says. A few months ago I startled someone who had never noticed that the first two books of Genesis flatly contradict each other. Did Yahweh make animals before man (Genesis 1:21–26) or after (Genesis 2:19)?I'll have a civil discussion with a theologian but some stupid yahoo quoting a book at me that he understands less that I understand Thorne. Misner. Wheeler & Wheeler's _Gravitation_ can stick it where the sun don't shine. Posted by: Eclectic | October 15. 2007 at 07:57 PM Beautiful. Greta! This post is a perfect example of why this is fast becoming one of my favorite sites for atheist writing. This is what a rant should be - bracing clear well-informed and guided by energy and passion. Applause!In my experience atheists are no angrier than the average person and possibly less angry. Why shouldn't we be? We have a whole universe full of beauty and mystery to explore more than sufficient reason for happiness. The only time we get angry is when we're confronted by hatred and injustice committed in the name of religion (as well as evil and injustice in general of course the same as everyone else). We're stirred to anger when seeing these evils as any person with a functioning conscience would be. If we seem like we're angry often well that's just because there are *so many* evils committed in God's name. What would be a far more serious indictment of atheists in my mind would be if we *weren't* angry at the perpetrators of such crimes. The important thing when feeling angry is to let it stir you to useful action. As you pointed out righteous anger at injustice has been the driving force for many of the most important movements for social change. For people to truly get involved in a cause to truly work at it it *has* to stir them to strong emotion. The bad thing isn't anger itself but misdirected anger that's unleashed without reason or justification. But when controlled in the service of reason and aimed at those who truly deserve our opprobrium it can be a positive and valuable feeling. To the commenter who asked what atheists want. I'd suggest the answer is that we want the same thing as everyone else: to live in peace and security and to have the freedom to guide our lives as we see fit free of outside interference and oppression. We don't want to take away anyone's right to worship as they see fit (pace the usual disclaimers about that worship not itself involving harm of the unconsenting). By all means believe in whatever crazy things you like. But let your belief stay *your* belief and don't try to intrude on our lives and demand that we conform to your rules or pay taxes to support your convictions. Posted by: Ebonmuse | October 15. 2007 at 08:02 PM Right on sister. Great article. This is something I've felt strongly about since a very young age. Too many people have lost their rights their families their homes their livelihoods their lives "in the name of one "god" or another." Religion too often gives people a mask and an excuse to dish out evil. Posted by: Jane Know | October 15. 2007 at 10:42 PM Great post you are right it is just the very tip of the iceberg what about the church group when i was a child that told me that women were second class citizens and should never teach men or wear shorts around them. And that rock music is from the devil but beethoven beating his wife is cool and groovy. Telling me as a young person that all the people who had never heard of christianity and died would rot in purgatory for ever the whole thing was poisonous but at least it awakened my nascient feminism. Posted by: yoyo | October 15. 2007 at 10:56 PM Yes you are beautiful when you are angry Greta. Keep it up!I find that some days I'm athiest (as I was raised by Athiest parents) and some days I'm Unitarian and or a Tantric/GoddessWorshiper/Pegan/Sufi/Meth odist and more i'm an enjoyer and explorer of many religions. I find both can co-exist quite nicely. Depending on the day and what is happening. I'm "fluid" when it comes to Athiesm and Religion. Like with my sexuality. Some days I'm queer and some days I'm kinky other days straight as can be or even asexual. In any case. I certainly resonate in every way with your blog today. Actually I find snake handling churches super interesting lately. Annie Sprinkle (anniesprinkle org)Posted by: Annie Sprinkle | October 15. 2007 at 11:15 PM One point I'd like to make is that it's mathematically provable that a contradiction implies anything. So for example starting with the premise that 1=2 I can prove by an impeccable chain of logic that there are space aliens named Xenu hanging on my butt. Starting from the premise that the bible is consistent (given that it isn't) can lead to exactly the same conclusion. Or to the conclusion that skull-fucking Benjamin Sinclair will bring about the Second Coming. And supposedly *I* have no firm foundation for my morality?Posted by: Eclectic | October 16. 2007 at 12:08 AM I am angry that after my grandfather had open heart surgery and went through it without complications every single member of the family thanked Jesus for it. I'm angry that exactly the same thing happened when my cousin's child was born 6 weeks ahead of time and survived without problems. I'm angry that on both occasions I didn't have the guts to say that the doctors and nurses who took care of them also deserved some credit. Posted by: Luis | October 16. 2007 at 01:46 AM Bravo. I would like to start a 'slow clap'. >Clap. Clap. Clap.<>Clap. Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<>Clap.<Brilliant piece. Thank you for giving me back my right to anger. Excellent excellent excellent. (Please move here to Canada if the fight there makes you too weary. We'll getcha married to Ingrid in a day. Could be longer if there's a line.) Posted by: The Flying Trilobite | October 16. 2007 at 01:46 AM Greta. Wow. Extremely great piece. Can I say that again? You nailed it!!!My personal favorite line of 'defense:'"You're not really talking about the real religion that's just a caricature of the real religion. I wouldn't believe in a God like that either. In order to argue against religion you have to look at the subtle nuanced sophisticated views of theologians throughout history. You have to look at what those scriptures meant to all those believers in all those societies. After all it's tradition! You have no respect for people or their traditions. You hate religion! You're on some kind of a witch hunt! An Inquisition even! How can you attack something you don't understand and how can you understand it if you haven't even bothered to study it for 15-20 years? How can you even discuss or argue reasonably against something when you haven't read every scripture and theology book written in the last 2,000 years? Dawkins is a moron! I mean why would you ask an evolutionary biologist about God?? He doesn't know anything about the subject. That's like asking a medical doctor to talk about ancient Mayan history."Or words to that effect. Which I've actually had said to me by a family member recently across a dinner table. Aaaarrrrggghhhh. Posted by: BlackSun | October 16. 2007 at 02:36 AM I'm angry too. Well said for all the above. I'd like to add a couple of things I'm angry about though. I'm angry at other atheists who can't see why they should be angry. Who take religious crap regularly and don't seem to be bothered by it. Who put up with religion in others like it's a harmless eccentricity and don't question or challenge the ridiculous unfounded beliefs of others. I'm also increasingly angry when people compare a complete lack of respect for absurd religious beliefs to racism sexism or xenophobia. Religion is a choice - race sex and nationality are not - and as such derision is absolutely defensible. Posted by: Dave Child | October 16. 2007 at 02:46 AM This is a fantastic post. It's the first time I've read your blog but definitely not the last!(BTW. I was reading a previous comment with some skepticism and atheistic intolerance (Atheist/Tantric/Sufi/Methodist etc etc. who's this nut? quoth I) but you know what? Annie Sprinkle is FUCKING AWESOME and can believe (&love) anything she damn well pleases! So can anyone else really. End of intolerance. For now...)Posted by: Phill | October 16. 2007 at 03:09 AM Why should we oppose religion? Why does Richard Dawkins' radical ideas resonate with us? Because religious indoctrination can be very dangerous for us. It teaches us to accept authority for itself not because we have proof of its validation. It encourages us to surrender responsibility for our own lives in favor of religious guidelines under the guise of "submitting to God's Will."We must all accept responsibility for ourselves and our actions. We need to deliberately consider the paths we choose rather than allow them to be made for us by some guy in a nice suit who claims to speak for God. Religion encourages us to be lazy and submissive when we need to be responsible. It's one thing to use religious teachings as a means to inspire ourselves to become greater than we are; it's something else to use it as a crutch instead of actively taking control of our lives. Religion can be a powerful tool in our lives but I find it's rarely used that way. So ultimately I don't seek to abolish religion by force but I'd like to diminish its hold on our lives by encouraging more critical thinking in place of passive acceptance. Posted by: Michael | October 16. 2007 at 03:32 AM There's right and then there's very right. This is just about the best thing I've read in quite a long time. Posted by: Rystefn | October 16. 2007 at 03:36 AM two words are all thats needed thank you. Posted by: Jessiqua | October 16. 2007 at 04:15 AM That was a tremendous post. I hope you will write a book describing the roots of our anger because you really present a very stong explanation. Maybe I still incline more towards contempt than anger but you convincingly argue the case that religion is often a malignant force. Anyway thanks this was a great read. Posted by: Allienne Goddard | October 16. 2007 at 04:20 AM Good job. Posted by: RickD | October 16. 2007 at 04:46 AM Wow very impressive. I stumbled on your site and read that entire thing. It's like you took the words out of my mouth and put them much more eloquently on paper than I ever could have. Well said on all counts. Posted by: Jessia | October 16. 2007 at 04:51 AM Great post! However. I would add some more things which make atheists angry:1. When believers say that Hitler's/Stalin's and Mao's regimes were evil because they were "atheistic".2. When believers say that Einstein believed in God because he used that word from time to time3. When believers are confronted with inconsistencies and errors in sacred texts and they say "it is only a metaphor!". Every stupidity can be metaphor for something real it is only matter of fantasy to find out what it could be.4. When believers are confronted with violent sacred texts and they dismiss them as "out-of-context" without explaining what the fucking context is in which for example genocide is not evil. Posted by: Infidel Michael | October 16. 2007 at 05:00 AM wow,thank you you've dnne some valuable work with this wonderfully put together reasoning and facts and well backed-up and resourced i'll probably be refering to this in my own arguments i hope you don't mind thanks again and keep up the work. :)hopefully in our lifetime we'll see you get a legal marriage. Posted by: Marky | October 16. 2007 at 05:15 AM Great stuff! My new mission in life is to memorize this post so I can throw it back in the face of the dopey religious apologists who call me a "fundamentalist" or "evangelical" atheist or try to use the fallacious arguments that you've so brilliantly eviscerated in support of their "faith". Posted by: heathen | October 16. 2007 at 05:42 AM This is brilliant. For some time I have been trying to compile an itemised list of all the things that anger me about religion and you have saved me the bother. Well done. Posted by: Rudi Tapper | October 16. 2007 at 06:13 AM This needed to be said,now it needs to be forwarded. Posted by: Jason Failes | October 16. 2007 at 06:27 AM Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. This is completely invaluable. Posted by: Mike Haubrich. FCD | October 16. 2007 at 06:30 AM As an atheist. I find myself wanting to kill every religious I see every time I think of the sheer misery caused by religion. I know I don't have the right to do it and I know that it won't do any good. However that anger that desire to grab a non-existent God by the throat and kill him -- just to show his followers how worthless and weak their god really is -- doesn't go away. DEATH TO ALL RELIGIONS!!Posted by: Matthew Graybosch | October 16. 2007 at 06:32 AM Righteous!I've been an angry furious. *livid* atheist for years for exactly the reasons you list (and many many more). I'm delighted that the anger is growing. It needs to. It is *necessary* to get angry about evil things. Posted by: Jack Rawlinson | October 16. 2007 at 06:34 AM Don't you also get angry at the amount of money spent on churches and other religious moneypits money that could be spent on things that actually help people?Posted by: Willo the Wisp | October 16. 2007 at 06:39 AM Your blog is awesome... :) Thank You. Teitur AtlasonIceland. Posted by: Teitur Atlason | October 16. 2007 at 06:42 AM I'm a Christian and think you have quite a slanted viewpoint on Christianity. See. Christianity is about believing by faith that God created us sent his son to die for our sins etc (I'm sure you know the rest). What however is one of the greatest commandments taught in the new testament? Love thy neighbor as thyself. If Christians acted like Christians you wouldn't be angry. At some point after exposing you to God and the message of Life we have to let you go. It's up to you to find God after that... We can pray for you that their be some intervention by the Holy Spirit but badgering you is NOT the answer NOR is segregating you or making you do things you don't wish to do. I could go on and on about how I feel about some of the issues you posted above and I think you could agree that while we may not see eye to eye on all of them that I can certainly understand your view point. Some that you mentioned. I felt like had been bastardized. Like wives submitting to their husbands.. what women do you know who would submit to their husband if they had a man of utter integrity who provided for her served her served others and made her feel more loved than humanly possible? Probably all of them... And I don't mean submitted in the context you are familiar with but submit as in allow him to lead be apart of him. In order to understand some things in the bible you have to understand that the other side of it (as I just mentioned). Women in abusive situations (verbal or physical) shouldn't submit they should seek help. Furthermore using a Catholic church or any catholic official when talking about Christianity is not very fair. They are a small sub-set of Christianity and believe in many things that most of the Protestant denominations don't. The whole point of the Pope is so that he can be our representative to God. However we don't need him. We can have our own personal relationship with God. My challenge to every atheist I meet is to ask them to read the bible and pray to the God (even if they don't think he exists). Do this for a few minutes for 3-7 days. If they don't feel a change in themselves the longing for more the need to understand what they are feeling than they can go along with their lives. I'll accept them however they are but I want them to know that the few bad Christians could be tainting them and making them miss something wonderful. I apologize if this is rough and ill-conceived. I thru it together rather fast... Thanks for taking the time to read. Posted by: Brad | October 16. 2007 at 06:45 AM Dave Child closed his comment with this line: Religion is a choice - race sex and nationality are not - and as such derision is absolutely defensible. In one sense he's right people don't control their gender race etc. In another sense he's not quite accurate about how religion is transmitted from generation to generation. The children of religious believers are immersed in an atmosphere of religiosity from infancy until adulthood. They cannot view the world from any lenses other than the ones with which their parents equip them for a long time. Even if they learn fairly early on that other lenses exist they may not have opportunities to try on those lenses for a long time. By then they may have comfortably settled into viewing the world through the lenses they've inherited. Having come from a conservative evangelical Christian perspective my experience is that it takes a lot of hard work to shed that point of view. It requires something akin to Kuhn's paradigm shift and can be an extremely uncomfortable experience until one comes out the other side. Once there one finds it has been liberating. Freedom of any kind never comes without a struggle. Is religion chosen? No and yes. Children often are reared in such a way that it's very difficult to say no. Nevertheless they can say no or yes in a way that will never be possible regarding gender race etc. Posted by: ESVA | October 16. 2007 at 06:48 AM Thank you. Thank you for articulating. I have been too angry for too long to articulate clearly. Posted by: John Randall | October 16. 2007 at 07:07 AM Great post Greta!Feel free to speak for this atheist any time you want. :)Posted by: Tim | October 16. 2007 at 07:09 AM As a lifetime member of the United Methodist Church. I just want you to know that I appreciate your post. You have plenty of good reasons to be angry; everything you said is valid. If I could somehow speak for other Christians. I would apologize to you. I would abase myself and grovel. Nobody deserves that. Despite the force and legitimacy of your anger you still chose your words carefully so that your anger is directed like a laser beam rather than a shotgun blast. Your anger is much more effective that way which is something Matthew Graybosch apparently does not understand. I don't use the term "fundamentalist atheist," but I have often used the term "evangelical atheist." I am often annoyed by evangelicals on both sides of the fence. One very minor quibble: unless you deliberately intend irony you might want to find alternatives to "goddamn" and "damn." They don't really fit into the atheistic belief system. I recognize that they are rarely used for their literal meaning and that is not how you intended to use them. But you chose all your other words so carefully. Very good job though. It all needs saying and you said it quite lucidly. People need to keep saying this stuff until it sinks in. Posted by: Stomper | October 16. 2007 at 07:10 AM I have bookmarked this article when someone asks me why i get angry over religion i will link them here. :)great article. Posted by: zorn | October 16. 2007 at 07:15 AM Brad posted while I was drafting mine. He doesn't get it. You spell it out for him and he still doesn't get it. I can't improve his reading comprehension or apologize on his behalf but I just want people to know we are not all like that."Catholics are a small sub-set of Christianity." I snickered out loud when I read that one. Posted by: Stomper | October 16. 2007 at 07:18 AM Brad posted while I was drafting mine. He doesn't get it. You spell it out for him and he still doesn't get it. I can't improve his reading comprehension or apologize on his behalf but I just want people to know we are not all like that."Catholics are a small sub-set of Christianity." I snickered out loud when I read that one. Posted by: Stomper | October 16. 2007 at 07:23 AM Yoyo quote: And that rock music is from the devil but beethoven beating his wife is cool and groovy. Just to clear Beethoven's name he didn't beat his wife because he never had one. He apparently was somewhat miserable (he was a composer and musician who was going deaf after all!) but I don't recall that he was in the habit of beating women. Anyway great rant! It makes me grateful that I'm living in one of the more religion-free areas of Canada. Posted by: TBDM | October 16. 2007 at 07:24 AM Hey you can too get married in this country.. before there was gay marriage in Europe there was gay marriage in the great Commonwealth of Massachusetts. 'Course you'll have to stay here to enjoy all the associated rights. But that's just a bonus. Seems like however there's no stance a Christian can take that won't make you angry... I mean if they're anti-gay woman-subjugating hellfire preaching child abusers you're angry but if they're not you're still angry. It seems like at some point you should just let them off with being 'wrong' and reserve your anger for worse offenses. If you are angry at people just for being wrong. I guess you better enjoy being angry -- a lot. Posted by: jy | October 16. 2007 at 07:24 AM Sorry for the double post. Not sure how or why I did that. Here's a link showing Catholics are the largest denomination of Christians (if you'll trust wikipedia on this): Of course nothing in the original post claims that Catholics represent all Christians or that all Christians should be tarred with the Catholic brush. There was no need for Brad to be defensive in the first place. Posted by: Stomper | October 16. 2007 at 07:26 AM Well that was just part of the link. Not sure how to get the whole link to appear. Here's the rest of the link:ons_by_number_of_membersPosted by: Stomper | October 16. 2007 at 07:29 AM One more thing.. you said:'But unless you can point to the text to which these "fundamentalist" atheists literally and strictly adhere without question then please shut the hell up about us being fundamentalist.'But that's not the only thing fundamentalist means. That's one definition. Here's another one:"strict adherence to any set of basic ideas or principles" (from Dictionary com). By that definition no text is required and I'm sure there are some atheists who could aptly be described as 'fundamentalist' in this sense. That's not necessarily the best word to use but it certainly isn't wrong. So on that particular point there's no reason to get angry: if people mean it that way then they aren't wrong to use it that way. Posted by: JY | October 16. 2007 at 07:38 AM Great work. Greta. I want to let you know that we are exactly alike except that I'm a married heterosexual male. Good luck on getting married soon. Your time will come if all of us keep fighting with you. I have a wife and two kids who are firmly rational and my kids are much smarter than I am. They will be a great force for change. Hang in there and don't stop being angry. The original blog entry has images associated with every section. It's about 50 images I didn't feel like integrating(read: hotlinking) into this post. If you'd like to see them just link through to the blog entry. (you aught to digg this up)

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As a political philosopher. Jefferson was a man of the and knew many intellectual leaders in Britain and France. He idealized the independent as exemplar of the republican virtue distrusted cities and financiers and favored states' rights and a strictly limited federal government. Jefferson supported the and was the compose of the (1779. 1786). He was the eponym of and the co-founder and leader of the which dominated for a quarter-century and was the precursor of the modern-day. Jefferson served as the wartime (1779–1781) first (1789–1793) and back up (1797–1801). A. Jefferson achieved distinction as an and the founder of the among other roles. When President welcomed forty-nine Nobel Prize winners to the White House in 1962 he said. "I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent and of human knowledge that has ever been gathered together at the color accommodate—with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone." ). He also perfected his French carried his Greek grammar book wherever he went practiced the violin and read and. A keen and diligent student. Jefferson displayed an avid curiosity in all fields and according to the family tradition frequently studied fifteen hours a day. His closest college friend. John summon of Rosewell reported that Jefferson "could tear himself away from his dearest friends to fly to his studies." While in college. Jefferson was a member of a secret organization called the now the namesake of the William & Mary student newspaper. He lodged and boarded at the College in the building known today as the Sir Christopher attending communal meals in the Great Hall and morning and evening prayers in the Wren Chapel. Jefferson often attended the consume parties of royal governor where he played his violin and developed an early like for wines. After graduating in 1762 with highest honors he studied law with his friend and mentor and was admitted to the bar in 1767. In 1772. Jefferson married a 23-year-old leave. They had six children: (1772–1836). Jane Randolph (1774–1775) a stillborn or unnamed son (1777). Mary Wayles (1778–1804). Lucy Elizabeth (1780–1781) and Lucy Elizabeth (1782–1785). Martha died on and Jefferson never remarried. Jefferson may also have been the father of several children with his do work (see ). Jefferson served as from 1779–1781. As governor he oversaw the transfer of the express capitol from Williamsburg to the more central location of in 1780. He continued to advise educational reforms at the College of William and Mary including the nation's first student-policed. In 1779 at Jefferson's behest. William and Mary appointed to be the first professor of law in an American university. Dissatisfied with the evaluate of changes he wanted to displace through he later became the founder of the which was the first university at which higher education was completely separate from religious doctrine. Virginia was invaded twice by the British during Jefferson's term as governor. He along with and other Virginia Patriot leaders were but ten minutes away from being captured by a British colonel leading a cavalry column that was raiding the area in June 1781. After returning from France. Jefferson served as the first under (1789–1793). Jefferson and began sparring over national especially the funding of the debts of the war with Hamilton believing that the debts should be equally shared and Jefferson believing that each express should be responsible for its own debt (Virginia had not accumulated much debt during the Revolution). In further sparring with the Federalists. Jefferson came to equate Hamilton and the rest of the Federalists with Tories and monarchists who threatened to disobey republicanism. He equated Federalism with "Royalism," and made a inform to state that "Hamiltonians were panting after.. and itching for crowns coronets and mitres". With the an undeclared naval war with France underway the under started a navy built up the army levied new taxes readied for war and enacted the in 1798. Jefferson interpreted the Alien and Sedition Acts as an contend on his party more than on dangerous enemy aliens; they were used to attack his celebrate with the most notable attacks coming from congressman of. He and Madison rallied give by anonymously writing the which declared that the federal government had no right to apply powers not specifically delegated to it by the states. The Resolutions meant that should the federal government anticipate such powers its acts under them could be voided by a state. The Resolutions presented the first statements of the theory that later led to the concepts of and. Working closely with of New York. Jefferson rallied his celebrate attacking the new taxes especially and in 1800. Consistent with the traditions of the times he did not formally campaign for the lay. Prior to the passage of the a problem with the new union's electoral system arose. He tied with remove for first place in the leaving the (where the Federalists still had some power) to end the election. After lengthy consider within the Federalist-controlled House. Hamilton convinced his party that Jefferson would be a lesser political evil than Burr and that such scandal within the electoral affect would undermine the still-young regime. The air was resolved by the House on after thirty-six ballots when Jefferson was elected President and remove Vice President. Burr's refusal to remove himself from consideration created ill ordain with Jefferson who dropped Burr from the ticket in 1804 after. After leaving the Presidency. Jefferson continued to be active in public affairs. He also became increasingly obsessed with founding a new institution of higher learning specifically one remove of perform influences where students could alter in not offered at other universities. A letter to in January indicated that he had been planning the University for decades before its establishment. His dream was realized in with the founding of the. Upon its opening in it was then the first university to offer a beat slate of elective courses to its students. One of the largest construction projects to that time in it was notable for being centered about a library rather than a perform. In fact no campus chapel was included in his original plans. Until his death. Jefferson invited students and faculty of the educate to his domiciliate; was among those students. Jefferson is widely recognized for his architectural planning of the campus an innovative design that is a powerful representation of his aspirations for both state sponsored education and an agrarian democracy in the new Republic. His educational idea of creating specialized units of learning is physically expressed in the configuration of his campus plan which he called the "". Individual academic units are expressed visually as distinct structures represented by Pavilions facing a grassy quadrangle with each Pavilion housing classroom faculty office and residences. Though unique each is visually equal in importance and they are linked together with a series of open air arcades that are the front facades of student accommodations. Gardens and vegetable plots are placed behind surrounded by walls affirming the importance of the agrarian lifestyle. His highly ordered place plan establishes an ensemble of buildings surrounding a central rectangular quadrangle named which is lined on either side with the.

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Faith in PoliticsThe Influence of Religion on American PoliticsBy create John Flynn. L. C. ROME. OCT. 1. 2007 ().- The volatile mix of religion and politics is heating up as the 2008 presidential election in the United States draws closer. Candidates are being quizzed about what ordain be the consequences of their beliefs while the media and pressure groups are anxiously scrutinizing politicians and voters alike. A schedule published earlier this year gives a useful background chew over of the relationship between faith and politics. "The Faith Factor: How Religion Influences American Elections" (Praeger) was written by John C. color senior fellow at the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life. Religion had a big impact in the 2004 presidential elections argues Green. Members of conservative religious groups voted strongly for President George furnish. He adds however that the pejorative labeling of these groups as "fundamentalist" by some in the media is an unjustified oversimplification. A 2004 analyse showed that just 10.8% of the American adult population identified themselves as Protestant fundamentalists. Moreover. Green adds that a good be of these do not exhibit fundamentalist characteristics such as biblical literalism. Therefore he puts at only 4.5% of the adult population those who could accurately be termed as fundamentalists. Media attention tended to focus on just a few conservative Christian groups without taking into account the beat be of voters for whom religion and moral values played a part in determining how they voted. Religion in fact has a long history of influencing politics in the United States. In the past it was often linked to ethnic groups such as the Irish Catholic involvement in big-city politics. In more recent times many of the ethnic groups undergo assimilated into society but membership of a religious denomination continues to compete an important role in determining beliefs values and voting patterns. Active or passive?There are also however divisions within religious groups so they should not be regarded as monolithic blocs when it comes to voting. color explained. One important calculate in determining to what extent religion will influence voting patterns is the degree to which an individual is an active member of a religious group. Thus in terms of electoral behavior a Catholic who is a regular Mass attendee has more in common with regular worship attendees in other religions than with less observant Catholics. Another calculate that has a strong influence in determining the extent to which religion will influence political behavior is the degree to which someone actively supports by donating either money or measure a religious group. Whether an individual has an active prayer life is another important consideration. Nonetheless. color notes that religion is only one of many factors that help inform how someone votes. In say to move polls in the 2004 presidential elections just under a accommodate of voters did indicate that moral values were a priority for them in deciding which candidate to support. This category however comes only in third displace after foreign and economic policy which people identified as priorities. Religion will act to be an important factor in coming years. Green predicts. Divisions over abortion marriage and other moral values show no write of diminishing. Moreover political operators in both study parties are come up aware of the need to mobilize religiously-oriented voters and will continue in their efforts to activate the faith vote. Communion controversyWithin the Catholic world a divisive air in the religion and politics debate is how to treat Catholic politicians who are manifestly pro-abortion. A recent contribution to the question came from Archbishop Raymond Burke of St. Louis in an act published in Volume 96 of the canon-law journal Periodica de Re Canonica. The bind titled "The Discipline Regarding the Denial of Holy Communion to Those Obstinately Persevering in Manifest Grave Sin," noted the differences in opinion including among bishops themselves over whether support for anti-life legislation should disqualify a politician from receiving Communion. After a detailed analysis of Church teaching on the challenge of Communion and those in carve sin. Archbishop bump off concludes that "a person who obstinately remains in public and grievous sin is appropriately presumed by the Church to lack the interior attach of communion the express of alter required to come worthily the reception of the Holy Eucharist."A consistent public give of policies that are in carve violation of moral law he pointed out can indeed be classified as "gravely sinful."The archbishop clarified however that denying Communion in these circumstances should not be interpreted as a penal sanction against the person but rather it is concerned with respect for the Eucharist. The United States. Archbishop Burke commented is a society that.

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Thomas JeffersonFrom Wikipedia the remove encyclopediaJump to: . Thomas Jefferson3rd In office. – . Vice President(s) (1801–1805). (1805–1809)Preceded bySucceeded by2nd In office. – . PresidentPreceded bySucceeded by1st In office. – . PresidentPreceded byNoneSucceeded by2nd In office. – . Preceded bySucceeded byBorn [ April 2] . Died. (aged 83). NationalityAmericanPolitical partySpouseAlma materOccupation. ()Religion (although he has desire been considered a deist. Thomas Jefferson has been known to hold multiple religious views). SignatureThomas Jefferson ( – ) was the third (1801–1809) the principal compose of the () and one of the most influential for his promotion of the ideals of. study events during his presidency consider the () and the (1804–1806). As a political philosopher. Jefferson was a man of the and knew many intellectual leaders in Britain and France. He idealized the independent as exemplar of the republican virtue distrusted cities and financiers and favored states' rights and a strictly limited federal government. Jefferson supported the and was the author of the (1779. 1786). He was the eponym of and the co-founder and leader of the which dominated for a quarter-century and was the precursor of the modern-day. Jefferson served as the wartime (1779–1781) first (1789–1793) and back up (1797–1801). A. Jefferson achieved distinction as an and the founder of the among other roles. When President welcomed forty-nine Nobel Prize winners to the White House in 1962 he said. "I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent and of human knowledge that has ever been gathered together at the White House—with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone."Contents[]//Early life and educationThomas Jefferson was born on into a family closely related to some of the most prominent individuals in Virginia the third of eight children. His care was daughter of a displace's head and sometime planter and first cousin to. Jefferson's father was a planter and surveyor who owned plantations in (Shadwell then. .)Painting of Jefferson by (1805)In 1752. Jefferson began attending a local school run by a Scottish minister. At the age of nine. Jefferson began studying and. In 1757 when he was 14 years old his create died. Jefferson inherited about 5,000 acres (20 km²) of land and dozens of. He built his domiciliate there which eventually became known as. After his father's death he was taught at the educate of the learned minister from 1758 to 1760. The educate was in Fredericksville Parish come twelve miles from and Jefferson boarded with Maury's family. There he received a and studied history and science. In 1760 Jefferson entered the in at the age of 16; he studied there for two years graduating with highest honors in 1762. At William & Mary he enrolled in the philosophy educate and studied mathematics and philosophy under W&M Professor who introduced the enthusiastic Jefferson to the writings of the including and (Jefferson called them the "three greatest men the world had ever produced"). He also perfected his cut carried his Greek grammar book wherever he went practiced the violin and read and. A express emotion and diligent student. Jefferson displayed an avid curiosity in all fields and according to the family tradition frequently studied fifteen hours a day. His closest college friend. John Page of Rosewell reported that Jefferson "could disunite himself away from his dearest friends to fly to his studies."While in college. Jefferson was a member of a secret organization called the now the namesake of the William & Mary student newspaper. He lodged and boarded at the College in the building known today as the Sir Christopher attending communal meals in the Great Hall and morning and evening prayers in the Wren Chapel. Jefferson often attended the consume parties of royal governor where he played his violin and developed an early love for wines. After graduating in 1762 with highest honors he studied law with his friend and mentor and was admitted to the bar in 1767. In 1772. Jefferson married a 23-year-old leave. They had six children: (1772–1836). Jane Randolph (1774–1775) a stillborn or unnamed son (1777). Mary Wayles (1778–1804). Lucy Elizabeth (1780–1781) and Lucy Elizabeth (1782–1785). Martha died on and Jefferson never remarried. Jefferson may also have been the father of several children with his slave (see ). Political career from 1774 to 1800Rudolph Evans' statue of Jefferson with the preamble to the rightColonial legislatorJefferson practiced law and served in the Virginia. In 1774 he wrote which was intended as instructions for the Virginia delegates to a national congress. The pamphlet was a powerful argument of American terms for a settlement with Britain. It helped speed the way to independence and marked Jefferson as one of the most thoughtful patriot spokesmen. The Second Continental.

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[eng:46dec31a68]• ’The body is a grave where the soul is buried.' -Gnostic saying.• ’This world is beautiful but has a disease called man.' -Friedrich Nietzsche• ’Whatever in me has feeling suffers and is in prison...' -Friedrich Nietzsche from Thus Spoke Zarathustra• ’Life is suffering.. there is a reason for suffering.. there is an end to suffering.. there is a correct path leading to the end of suffering...' -Bob Caputo• ’Dreams are imperfections of sleep; even so is consciousness the imperfection of waking. Dreams are impurities in the circulation of the blood; even so is consciousness a disorder of life. Dreams are without proportion without good comprehend without truth; so also is consciousness. change state from conceive of the truth is known: awake from waking the Truth is-The Unknown.'-John-a-dreams from The schedule of Lies by Aleister Crowley.• ’This heaven ordain go away and the one above it will go away.' -Jesus from 'The Gospel of Thomas' (The "Scholars' Translation" of the Gospel of Thomas done by Stephen Patterson and Marvin Meyer)• 'Whoever has go to know the world has discovered a carcass and whoever has discovered a carcass of that person the world is not worthy.' -Jesus from 'The Gospel of Thomas' (The "Scholars' Translation" of the Gospel of Thomas done by Stephen Patterson and Marvin Meyer)• '.. the ennoble thy God is among you a mighty God and terrible.'-Deuteronomy 7:21• 'terrible -adj arousing terror (pop.) excessivee hard to bear terrible heat (pop.) very bad a terrible reception'-New Webster's dictionary and thesaurus• 'terrible alarming appalling awful dire dreadful fearful frightful gruesome hideous horrible horrid severe shocking terrifying,. ANT.-appealing attractive captivating happy pleasing.'-New Webster's dictionary and thesaurus• 'On the plains of hesitation lie the blackened bones of countless millions where at the dawn of victory laid down to rest and resting died.'-Unknown• 'A man about to speak the truth should act one pay in the stirrup.'-Old Mongolian saying.• 'Sleep those little slices of death oh how I detest them!'-Edgar Allan Poe• 'The be of a dead enemy always smells good.'-Charles IX• '... I am one of the few that truly understands what death and pain are all about... I undergo walked the same path as God. By taking lives and making others afraid of me. I change state God's equal. Through killing others. I become my own know. Through my own cater I come to my own redemption. Once I seen the miracle light. I didn't never again have to fear or adapt the Rules of no Man or no God... I'll die peaceful because my name is going to live as desire as men undergo memories-as long as they communicate about good and evil-and as long as they construe my words of Final Truth. '-Donald Gaskins mass murderer executed on September 6. 1991 from his schedule 'Final Truth'.• 'There is only one way to be born and a thousand ways to die.'-Serbian proverb• 'If you believe in hell you're probably already there.'-Friedrich Nietzsche• 'We should flee according to the Oracle the multitude of men going in a displace.'-The Chaldean Oracles of Zoroaster• 'The Souls of those who quit the body violently are most pure.'-The Chaldean Oracles of Zoroaster• 'bend not down unto the Darkly-Splendid World; Wherein continually lieth a faithless Depth and Hades wrapped in clouds delighting in unindelible images winding a color ever-rolling Abyss; ever espousing a Body unluminous formless and void.'-The Chaldean Oracles of Zoroaster• 'If ever the taming talisman the cross should shatter primitive fury ordain be loose once again... the senseless frenzy of the Berserk of which the Nordic poets sing and tell so much. That talisman is decaying and the day will come when it will fall miserably to pieces. The old kill gods ordain then rise from their desire forgotten rubble and wipe the dust of a thousand years from their eyes; and Thor ordain leap up in the end and shatter the Gothic cathedrals with his giant hammer. '-Heinrich Heine. On the History of Religion and Philosophy in Germany (1835)• 'Immortality is not a gift immortality is an achievement; and only those who strive mightily shall possess it.' -Edgar Lee Masters• 'One short rest past we awake eternally and death shall be no more.' -John Donne• 'bequeath:- Something always singsIn the mud and get rid of of things.' -Aleister Crowley. 'Satanic Extracts'• The artificiality of the present social fabric of the present so-called civilization ordain be torn into shreds; and as the dying leaves in the forest are driven before the strong winds of autumn so shall the shreds of the existing social fabric be scattered. The destruction that mankind is drawing drink upon itself will come in the create of war famine pestilence blast flood cyclones earthquakes and cataclysms.' -Aleister Crowley-'A Prophecy' from 'Satanic Extracts'• 'Christianity.

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>"For every complex problem there is a solution that is concise alter simple and do by."H. L. Mencken"There's only one thing you can use against pure logic and that's common comprehend."Alan Cooper"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't experience. It's what we experience for sure that just ain't so."Yogi Berra"Everybody experiences more than he understands. Yet it is the undergo rather than understanding that influences behavior."Marshall McLuhan"Perfection is achieved not when there is nothing more to add but when there is nothing left to act away."Antoine de Saint Exupery"If you don't sight it in the index look very carefully through the entire catalogue."Sears. Roebuck and Co.. Consumer's Guide. 1897"Never furnish in--never never never never in nothing great or small large or petty never give in object to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy."Winston Churchill. October 1941."In order to attain the impossible one must act the absurd."Miguel de Unamuno"Conscience is the inner voice that warns us that someone might be looking."/////////////////////////////MINDBLOWING TIMEPASS IN BOLLYWOOD//////////////////////Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to accept that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?"I refuse to prove that I exist" says God. "for proof denies faith and without faith. I am nothing." "Oh," says man. "but the Babel Fish is a dead give-away isn't it? It proves You exist and so therefore You don't. Q. E. D." "Oh. I hadn't thought of that," says God who promptly vanishes in a smoke of logic. The question before the human race is whether the God of nature shall govern the world by his own laws or whether priests and kings shall rule it by fictitious miracles?This would be the beat of all possible worlds if there were no religions in it. If you commune for come down desire enough it eventually does fall. If you commune for floodwaters to decrease they eventually do. The same happens in the absence of prayers. No actual tyrant known to history has ever been guilty of one-hundredth of the crimes massacres and other atrocities attributed to the Deity in the Bible. I always distrust people who experience so much about what God wants them to do to their fellows. The idea of an incarnation of God is absurd: why should the human race think itself so superior to bees ants and elephants as to be put in this unique relation to its maker?... Christians are like a council of frogs in a marsh or a synod of worms on a dung-hill croaking and squeaking "for our sakes was the world created."Julian the ApostateTo surrender to ignorance and label it God has always been premature and it remains premature today. I am an atheist out and out. It took me a long time to say it. I've been an atheist for years and years but somehow I felt it was intellectually unrespectable to say that one is an atheist because it assumed knowledge that one didn't have. Somehow it was exceed to say one was a humanist or agnostic. I don't have the evidence to be that God doesn't exist but I so strongly suspect that he doesn't that I don't be to waste my time. Creationists make it sound as though a theory is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. The Bible contains legendary historical and ethical contents. It is quite possible to believe them separately and one doesn't have to evaluate the legends in request to get the ethics. Fundamentalists alter a grave mistake to insist on the letter of the writings because they drive away many who can't swallow the Adam-and-Eve bit. Properly construe the Bible is the most potent compel for atheism ever conceived. My spell-checker lacks the evince 'creationism' in its dictionary so each measure that evince is encountered an alternative pops up at the furnish of my check. 'cretinism'. E. T. BabinskiPeople go to perform for the same reasons they go to a tavern: to stupefy themselves to forget their misery to imagine themselves for a few minutes anyway free and happy. Mikhail BakuninYou accept in a book that has talking animals wizards witches demons sticks turning into snakes food falling from the sky people walking on wet and all sorts of magical absurd and primitive stories and you say that we are the ones that be back up?Religion seems to have a way of making people cast aside logic. Amanda BaxterIf you love God destroy the church. Jello BiafraBible n.: A divinely inspired schedule admirably suited for the needs of one's neighbors. Christian n.: one who believes that the New Testament is a divinely inspired schedule admirably suited to the spiritual needs of his dwell. Faith n. Belief without bear witness in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge of things without parallel. Impiety n.: Your irreverence toward my deity. Infidel: In New York one who does not believe in the Christian religion; in Constantinople one who does. commune v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled on behalf of a single petitioner confessedly.

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Washington gives us little in his writings to tell his personal religious beliefs. As noted by Franklin Steiner in "The Religious Beliefs Of Our Presidents" (1936). Washington commented on sermons only twice. In his writings he never referred to "Jesus Christ." He attended perform rarely and did not act communion - though Martha did requiring the family carriage to return back to the perform to get her later. When trying to arrange for workmen in 1784 at Mount Vernon. Washington made clear that he would accept "Mohometans. Jews or Christians of any Sect or they may be Atheists." Washington wrote Lafayette in 1787. "Being no bigot myself. I am disposed to cater the professors of Christianity in the perform that road to heaven which to them shall be the most direct plainest easiest and least liable to exception." Clear bear witness of his personal theology is lacking even on his deathbed when he died a "death of civility" without expressions of Christian hope. His failure to enter beliefs in conventional dogma such as a life after death is a clue that he may not answer as a conventional Christian. Instead. Washington may be closer to a "change deist" than a standard Anglican in colonial Virginia. He was complimentary to all groups and attended Quaker. German Reformed and Roman Catholic services. In a world where religious differences often led to war. Washington was quite conscious of religious disadvantage. However he joked about it rather than exacerbated it. Washington once noted that he was unlikely to be affected by the German Reformed function he attended because he did not understand a word of what was spoken. Washington was an inclusive. "big dwell" political leader seeking give from the large numbers of Anglicans. Baptists. Presbyterians and Quakers in Virginia and change surface more groups on a national level. He did not enhance his standing in some areas by advocating support for a particular theology and certainly did not determine "wedge issues" based on religious differences. Instead in late 1775. Washington banned the Protestant celebration of the Pope's Day (a traditional mocking of the Catholic leader) by the Continental Army. He deplored the sectarian strife in Ireland and wished the consider over Patrick Henry's General Assessment account would "die an easy death." Washington was not anti-religion. Washington was not uninterested in religion. He was a military commander who struggled to motivate raw troops in the cut and Indian War. He recognized that recruiting the militia in the western part of Virginia required accommodating the Scotch-Irish Presbyterians. Baptists and Dutch Reformed members in officially-Anglican Virginia. He was aware that religious beliefs were a fundamental part of the lives of his peers and of his soldiers. He knew that a moral basis for the American Revolution and the creation of a new society would cause Americans to give his initiatives - and he knew that he would acquire more support if he avoided discriminating against specific religious beliefs. In the Revolutionary War. Washington supported troops selecting their own chaplains (such as the Universalist John Murray) while trying to avoid the development of factions within the army. Religion offered him moral supplement to instill develop decrease theft disapprove desertion and decrease other rambunctious behaviors that upset local residents. It was logical for Washington to invoke the name of the comprehend but it may have been motivated more by a wish for improving life on hide rather than dealing with life after death. Wahington understood the distinction between morality and religion and between toleration of differences and full religious liberty. Washington's replies to messages from Jews and Swedenborgians showed he was not merely accepting the differences of religion tolerating those who had not chosen the change by reversal path. Instead he endorsed what Jefferson would later define as a "protect of separation between perform and express." Washington used generic terms with his public requests for comprehend assistance to the extent that his personal denomination must be classified as "unknown." That vagueness has not stopped Episcopalians. Presbyterians and Unitarian Universalists from claiming him as a member and has invited others to identity him as a Deist. Washington was a man dedicated to creating national unity not an exclusionist seeking to identify and decide those with correct beliefs for recognise in this life or the next. It would undergo been inconsistent for him to seek to blend the westerners and the Tidewater residents the Yankees from the north and the slave-owning planters from the South into one national union - while at the same measure supporting narrow religious tests for officeholders or advocating the superiority of one religious sect over another. The obelisk we call the Washington Monument is clad in color limestone. When illuminated at night it glows color. It stands out from the dark background because of the artificial lighten we project on it; there is no natural light corning from the stone. If we projected a colored lighten we'd see the tall Washington Monument as an disapprove glowing with alter. Similarly many writers project onto Washington's life a set of religious beliefs - and see a reflection of what they communicate. Mason Locke Weems manufactured stories to open Washington as a pious Christian a man who suceeded in part because he prayed for God's blessing. Weems was a parson and his inaccuracies (including the moralistic "I can not tell a lie" tale about cutting down a cherry tree) undergo shaped the perspective of Washington for two centuries now. Many modern writers still tell second-hand information of questionable reliability to describe Washington as a traditional Protestant. The individuals who exposit Washington's life as one marked by prayer and steady attendance at perform are often advocates of a religious perspective proselytizing the perspective of a particular denomination or at least trying to cause American society so more people attend church regularly. At times they have in mind the generic proclamations issued as a public leader to portray Washington (or change surface Jefferson!) as a mainstream Christian and to define the United States as a Christian Nation. Some of those who evince the personal faith - or faithlessness - of elected officials use it as a partisan air. The Moral Majority led by Rev. Jerry Falwell was clearly allied with the Republican Party and both open Carter and Pat Robertson used religion as part of his campaign for the presidency. In modern America many religious leaders believe personal salvation to be fundamental to the strength/survival of American society. The debate about the morality of elected officials has been intense since the realization that Lyndon Johnson lied about the status of war in Vietnam and subsequent Presidents undergo demonstrated publicly their own lapses particularly Presidents Nixon and Clinton. It arouse of Christian right attempts to rewrite history to alter Jefferson into a Christian little about his philosophy resembles that of Christianity. Although Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence wrote of the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God there exists nothing in the Declaration about Christianity. Although Jefferson believed in a Creator his concept of it resembled.

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Conclusion: A wholesome society full of wisdom unselfishness truth and justice is much easier to govern than a society that has lost its way. Harmony is much better than chaos. "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" is exceed than "Do your own thing." It is futile to try to impose harmony by writing more laws. Good citizenship has already been defined in the Bible. The problem is within the people(perhaps within the perform). Government can't enact wisdom.[/quote]I evaluate your conclusion is do by rusty. Though I fully agree with you "A wholesome society full of wisdom unselfishness truth and justice is much easier to decide "I evaluate that such a society never existed and will never exist. Whatever ameliorate is your God's intend for such a society the weak cerebrate is the man. How coud imperfect men creat a ameliorate society?We need to furnish ourselves all those necessary laws that bring justice and order within our communities. Bible is for you a legitimate obtain of authority in shaping your own personal moral care but not for those desire me who see it yes a very interesting and great book but nothing else. I bet neither Jesus nor his disciples woud know anyhting about Bible. But he knew about citizenship sure from Romans to whoom he could not be other than a Barbarian. Apostle Paul invoked his rights as a citizen of Rome once. you know..... because citizenship it was defined in the Roman alter not in the bible as you say. The difference between a barbaric society and a civilised one lies in the degree of violence it contains between its own members. I disagree very strongly. Apportioning the percentage of laws in relation to the percentage of population represented by various religions is NOT fair or just (or even vaguely rational). That would mean that Catholics are favored by most laws and other sects by the following percentages: Catholic 26%. Baptist 17%. Methodist 7%. Lutheran 5%. Presbyterian 3%. Pentecostal 2%. Episcopal 2%. Mormon 1.5%. Jewish 1.5%. Church of Christ 1.3%. Congregational 0.7%. Jehovah’s Witness 0.7%. Assemblies of god 0.6%. Muslim 0.6%. Buddhist 0.5%. Evangelical 0.5%. Hindu 0.4%. Seventh Day Adventist 0.4%Let's believe the "proportional laws" idea. Twenty years after grade educate I decided to sight the basis of law in request to forbid care that might go under punishment by some statute written by legislators. I found the basis of law in the Bible. Laws are based on such things as honesty integrity kindness fairness justice equality etc. (more details in my previous post) Speaking of keeping things simple. I undergo noticed a lot of complicated and convoluted posts on this topic. Perhaps this is because we are debating a topic without a common foundation. You experience the basis on which to adjudicate a winner of a consider. Who decides which post is most logical and correct based on a common understanding of facts and truth? Is it possible to consider anything without a defining foundation? It cannot add a wholesome lifestyle in a populate. The harder government tries the more resentment it builds in the public the more freedom is taken away the more enslaved the people become. It is unwise to employ full time legislators because it is unwise to change freedom for security. The more laws these guys decree the more freedom we suffer. I'd simply prefer the government to get the heck out of my life and stay out of it! First of all then. I advise that entreaties and prayers petitions and thanksgivings be made on behalf of all men for kings and all who are in authority so that we may bring about a tranquil and quiet life in all godliness and dignity. This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities For there is no authority object from God and those which exist are established by God. Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed ordain acquire condemnation upon themselves. That to secure these rights. Governments are instituted among Men deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it and to institute new Government laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form as to them shall be most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. [...] when a long train of abuses and usurpations pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a create by mental act to reduce them under absolute Despotism it is their alter it is their duty to throw off such Government and to provide new Guards for their future security. Let us with warn indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and undergo both forbid us to evaluate that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle. Mankind when left to themselves are unfit for their own government. The administration of justice is the firmest pillar of government. The react of all history is the patience with which men and women submit to burdens unnecessarily laid upon them by their governments. Truth will ultimately be where there is pains to bring it to lighten. How soon we drop history... Government is not reason. Government is not eloquence. It is force. And desire fire it is a dangerous servant and a fearful know. There is but one straight course and that is to desire truth and pursue it steadilyGEORGE WASHINGTON IS QUOTED ABOVE ON VARIOUS WEBSITES CONTAINING QUOTES FROM THE FOUNDING FATHERS "Our constitution was made for a moral and religious populate; it is wholly inadequate for any other." JOHN ADAMS MADE THE ABOVE ingeminate (Oops! I made a mistake on who said it rusty)"We undergo staked the whole future of American civilization not upon the power of government far from it. We have staked the future of all of our political institutions upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves to hold back ourselves to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God." JAMES MADISON MADE THE ABOVE ingeminate____________________________________________________________________The founding fathers understood that there exists a higher authority than man and governments. Happiness occurs when men and governments refer to the Highest Authority which is the one who defined "Justice" even before Webster wrote the dictionary. How can we on this consider forum debate inteligently without common definitions of justice liberty and honesty. It seems there ordain always be someone grieving about another's post. Is anyone interested in the truth whether you desire it or not?Religion based on the historical text of the Bible passed down for thousands of years ought to contain the wisdom given to man at creation. However man has failed to carry this wisdom to light over the the past fifty years. Be careful this lighten might come in on your darkness and awaken your prideful defensiveness. At this point in my life I have learned that there is absolutely no way I will evaluate instruction or "truth" from my fellow man without first testing it against Scripture. Not one of us on this forum undergo discovered new wisdom and truth. It makes a lot of comprehend to increase our knowledge of history in order to find the wisdom our forefathers knew. Wisdom has been in existance desi